Recent searches
Search options
How interesting. so... #postmarketos with...
@martijnbraam If I can get systemd I will choose it, OpenRC works fine and I am somewhat used to it by now but I am still more familiar with systemd and it always worked great for me! We can argue if a project should be build dependent on systemd but maintaining them for other systems if that's not the goal of the project itself is just a waste of resources or at least looks like it from my uninformed and uninvolved point of view.
@martijnbraam has anyone gotten s6 working on pmos?
@ezra @martijnbraam not that I know of
@craftyguy @ezra @martijnbraam shouldn't be hard to get up and running though
@vitali64sur @ezra @martijnbraam POCs are usually easier than taking something to 100% and supporting it broadly.
@craftyguy @ezra @martijnbraam I mean, nothing prevents you from building and using s6 as PID 1, of course it wouldn't be officially supported but it would probably work..
@martijnbraam It seems that dealing with the hard dependencies of systemd crap is something really difficult. What a pity.
@martijnbraam there are at least three features that I find important from a DE perspective which are likely hard to get without systemd:
- Starting services on demand.
- Cgroup management. What I hope to see in the future is that we'll be able to throttle background apps way more aggressively, controlled by the compositor.
- homed. I want my data to be encrypted when the device is locked - without the key being in ram. Paired with TPM so I can relatively safely use a short pin/pw/pattern.
@martijnbraam If we're expecting my phone to run containers, and/or encapsulate programs in cgroups, yeah, #systemd.
if it's just gonna run everything in the same process tree, yeah #openrc.
"it depends" would have been a nice option.
@martijnbraam systemd winning is extremely disappointing!
@tcely
For all its flaws, there are some fairly awesome features it has that I don't think exist anywhere else.
Do you know of another service manager (doesn't have to be an initd) that allows for as much configuration over a service (sockets, permissions, alt roots, private directories, etc) in a simple config file? And uses #polkit for user permissions? I would love to play with it and depend on systemd less.
@martijnbraam
We apparently disagree on what systemd should be doing.
You want features, as if it is the operating system, I want to begin using the operating system to do the actual work without needing to depend on "features" of the utility that started various things for as long as the system is running.
I want whatever launched my services to do the job, then end, because the launcher should not be mediating my service's access to the operating system, in any way.
I see a future where we could have a mobile version of Fedora that is image-based ('atomic') and has a fully responsive GNOME-desktop! All technologies coming together!
@martijnbraam PMOS is too popular
@martijnbraam I vote musl for diversity. Too many applications assume glibc.
⎇ @martijnbraam Heh, as much pain as I have endured with musl, I still vote musl! And systemd!
@awooo @martijnbraam glibc "extensions" cause pain, not musl
@kanazir Yes, I know that in principle, but you can't always fix the software, because it may be a proprietary game server for instance that segfaults if ran on musl
Even better if you're forced to use something like box64 to run it, then you definitely need to suck it up and use a chroot
@martijnbraam systemd and whatever works. 
@martijnbraam i don't really care as long as it works, but I would always prefer a simpler solution if available
Ⓥ
Am I missing something here? I thought that #PostmarketOS had already decided to switch to #systemd, although I don't remember hearing a timeline.
Was I imagining that?
If not, what was the rough timeline? Q1? Q2? Q4?
@Blort they did recently announce switching to systemd on their blog-- i think Martijn is just gauging what people think about it :p
Yes, I think you're right.
@martijnbraam systemd needs to admit that it is trying to be an operating system and stop trying to infect everything Linux.
@martijnbraam I'm personally am an advocate for s6. Laurent Bercot has in my opinion done a great job with the architecture.