I'm using a quite customised keyboard layout, here are a little bit about that, and if you're interested in making writing feel better maybe it's worth a try :)

@sotolf Interesting. I have a similar journey with cyrilic layouts. I mostly type in two languages but those are English and Russian. these are two completely different layouts and character sets. No way one can pack both into a single layout. The issue I have is that I'm not using the "10 finger method". I type using 10 fingers but I learn to do it on a Z80 compatible computer long before I had gotten access to any learning materials.

@sotolf And there are two completely cyclic layouts I like. One I learned first and the one marked on all keyboards. The problem is whilst I can type on a keyboard having no markings at all it confuses me if a keyboard has one layout markings and I'm trying to use another one.

@lig Is the ciryllic standard layout more ergonomic for russian than the qwerty layout is for really any langauge at all? I've found that having different letters marked on my keyboard is a good thing for incentivising me to not look at the keyboard while practicing ;)

@sotolf I don't think it's more ergonomic. I believe it's just a variation. Historically, soviets wanted to do everything in their own way and maybe to make things for spies harder:) Older soviet computers have both layouts Latin/Cyrillic phonetically connected. Inevitably the Latin layout adaption changed to the standard English layout (mostly US but I see more UK in recent days) but the Cyrillic one was here to stay 🤷

@lig Ah so with so many other thing it's basically an artifact of a long history of changes ;) the Naive Norwegian layout is just qwerty with extra letters put on to the right side, but it makes coding annoying because { and } are written with Alt-gr + 7 and Alt-gr + 0 for some stupid reason.

@sotolf The good thing with Cyrillic layouts is that one cannot use them for coding because no Latin character available at all. Thus, you're forced to switch to the English layout.

@sotolf Oh:) There are a couple more that use Cyrillic symbols.
1C Company has it's own language which uses Cyrillic symbols, there was a Logo localization, and there are a number of special area languages as well.

@sotolf I tried to stop looking at the keyboard but it's stronger than me:) It's been almost 30 years for me with keyboards.

@lig Ah yeah, the closest you would come is probably with a ciryllic phonetic IME, but probably you'd end up with something that is quite likely to be suboptimal for both, I've been struggling with getting an IME To work well with my setup, since fcitx seems to ignore my layout set in xkb and just use an offset qwerty layout when I try to write japanese, which is annoyng.

@sotolf Actually, the layout I like the most (яверты) is phonetic:) There are some "hacks" in place as not all letters could be mapped one to one but it's close enough and doesn't remap punctuation characters that adopted as the mainstream layout does.

@sotolf I've been using simplified dvorak for a while now and I'm pretty happy with it, I am missing my programmer dvorak layout a lot tho. I switched away from it because it was just too incompatible with most software out there, but I might consider learning it again

@sotolf wow. And I get people complaining when they see me using us-int.

The one thing I learned early on on Sun type 4 keyboards and have kept to this day is use of the compose key for umlauts and other BS. Very liberating.

I'd love to have a mechanical keyboard with the left macro key columns, like the Keebio Sinc. Just hard to get over here in Europe.

@fedops What's more annoying for people are that I haven't shuffled my keycaps around, so they try to write and gibberish comes out :D yeah, getting some stuff is kind of annoying here :)

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