Why is everyone talking about ? Is it xmpp as in jabber? Is there a public server that people are using or something? What am I missing?

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@nsartor there has been a lot of conversation about it as due to changing their privacy policy a lot of people are moving to or and a lot of us here on think they should be choosing self hosted or with the conclusion that is the lighter option to self host

@softinio @nsartor This is true, but only because Matrix is newer and self-hosting is still kinda alpha, beta-stage and isn't feature-complete yet.

BUT.... I'd say is definitely a stronger option long-term than . I love using it. And I just have an account on matrix.org 's main server, but you can use on your chats and rooms as desired... so even if you aren't hosting it yourself, nobody but you on a verified login instance could access those chats.

@wholesomedonut @nsartor agreed. I also have reached the conclusion that Matrix client (element/riot) is probably better on

@wholesomedonut @softinio perhaps it was my use case, but I always used jabber as an IM, not a chat room/irc replacement. I see them ad different products, but like I said, its been years.

@nsartor @wholesomedonut @softinio Cisco acquired Jabber in 2008.

XMPP does both private conversations and group chats well, while Matrix focuses on being a "modern" alternative to IRC. I have a lot of opinions about Matrix, but let's not go there now. :)

I've been using XMPP since it was still Jabber and I never stopped using it. It's simply the option that sucks the least. :)

@hund @nsartor @wholesomedonut fun fact I was a big fan of jabber back in the day long time ago and even had my own ejabberd server some point in the 90s :-) But haven't touched it in a long time for better or worse

@softinio

Some point in the 90s would have been the second half of 1999. ☺️

@hund @nsartor @wholesomedonut

@0 @hund @nsartor @wholesomedonut so long ago don't remember exactly when, maybe even early 2000s (i'll commit to before 2010 😂)

@softinio

Yeah I have the same problem. 🙂

I do remember the year when I switched to my new personal account though: 2008. The one I use to this day.

@hund @nsartor @wholesomedonut

@0 @softinio @hund @wholesomedonut so nothing has really changed since the jabber days? I'm fortunate to get my circle on signal, I won't push for a change, just curious if I'm missing out.
FOSS projects I see are using matrix or discord.

@nsartor @0 @softinio @hund Matrix is a bit easier to use, as has been mentioned before, as a bit of a spiritual successor to IRC that’s decentralized and privacy centric.

XMPP is good old XMPP still.

You are only missing out on alternatives, not any great advantages. Signal is better than the majority of other options and moving mountains to get into Matrix or get them all in XMPP is more expensive in time and effort than it pays out.

@nsartor

> so nothing has really changed since the jabber days?

The technology has matured a lot. Nowadays we have message carbons #XEP0280 so you can jump from device to device mid-chat and server-side message archiving #XEP0313 so it's like moving from #POP3 to #IMAP. Also, file transfers work reliably thanks to #XEP0363 and a bunch of other goodies. It's an exciting beast indeed.

There's audio/video calls too.

@softinio @hund @wholesomedonut

@nsartor @softinio @hund @wholesomedonut

Get #BlabberIM for yourself, #Quicksy for everyone else and give it a spin. You won't regret it.

@nsartor @softinio @hund @wholesomedonut

And for the nerds amongst us, I've done some pretty sick stuff with #XMPP components #XEP0114. 😀

I can't / won't talk about specifics, but think adding agenda@berlin.cities.example.net and getting a feed of everything that happens there (entering your choice of city and category, e.g. flights@kabul.cities.example.net).

@nsartor @softinio @hund @wholesomedonut

Oh! And for those who use #XMPP primarily as a #chat system, the compliance suite series have really helped client and server implementers get on the same page as to what set of extensions to support / deprecate at a given point in time.

@nsartor @softinio @hund @wholesomedonut

What I unconditionally love about #XMPP is its sheer extensibility. As I mentioned, I've used it for some wild human-machine integration stuff.

Yes, I'm a fucking fanboy. And so very proud of it. ❤️

@0 @nsartor @hund @wholesomedonut for self hosting I am currently leaning towards Matrix for two reasons: 1) I already use matrix and have client installed 2) I need reliable notifications on IOS and I know element/riot does that well whereas I have heard mixed opinions on the clients available for for - someone correct me if I am wrong about item 2 😃

@softinio @0 @nsartor @hund @wholesomedonut well, the best way would be to actually verify the claim. As far as #siskinim is concerned - notifications should work just fine (and even better if you are using it with Tigase XMPP Server: github.com/tigase/tigase-serve)

@nsartor

Indeed, I find it amusing that kids nowadays seen to think of #XMPP as some kind of federated #Facebook or whatever the trendy silo is these days.

Nothing wrong with that, and #Movim is an interesting concept, but to me #XMPP as a human tool is about federated exchange of messages and presence, mostly 1-to-1.

By the same token, matrix seems to be a federated, eventually consistent data store that somehow got repurposed for group chat.

@wholesomedonut @softinio

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