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why does nixos-rebuild switch --upgrade want to download literally _every single package_ i have again? even if there is no version upgrade???

this sort of stuff makes me want to just give up and install ubuntu...

@peanutbutter144 If that’s the case then something changed for sure.

If almost everything is affected then some core package was updated (maybe a security fix in SSL) and now that change must be propagated through the system to make it reproducible.

That’s the trade‑off.

@kmicu hmm, ok. i guess ill leave it updating overnight tonight and see how it goes.

apart from this one issue, ive really liked nixos. but every now and then i wish i had chosen to use a more popular / lower maintenance distro...

@peanutbutter144 if downloading the whole system more or less every month is the deal breaker then I recommend switching to a traditional/mutable distro cuz that ‘we need to re‑download everything almost each month' part will never change in Guix/Nix (or any other reproducible system).

I think those projects should more prominently display and talk about their trade‑offs like much bigger disk usage, a lot more frequent compilation, and much bigger network bandwidth requirement.

@kmicu ok. i knew about the disk usage, thats mentioned somewhere easy to find on nixos.org but i didnt know about the amount of recompiling and network usage until i experienced it myself.

so i agree that nixos and guix should make that more prominent.

if the recompiles and full system re-download are as often as once a month, i might consider intalling a traditional distro instead, thats a bit top often for me i think...

@kmicu @peanutbutter144 I can't help to think https://github.com/NixOS/rfcs/pull/17 would make things better on that front.

It would probably require to drop the 100s of TB of cache we are currently sitting on :(

@Ninjatrappeur @peanutbutter144 that feature improves the situation in a sense that we get a little bit less compilation, downloads, and disk usage but those are still order of magnitude bigger than on a mutable distro.

By design Guix/Nix cannot minimize those resources as efficiently as mutable package managers—they can do this cuz they are allowed to lose information, to be not reproducible, and to brick our systems on an update ;)

@kmicu @peanutbutter144 I do agree about that.

That said, having to rebuild the whole (g)nixpkgs for every bash/systemd/(guix init system?) bump seems pretty bad to me.

What I was trying clumsily to point out was that even by staying reproducible, we have room for improvement in the optimization space :)

@Ninjatrappeur @kmicu it turns out updating my entire system didn't actually take that long, i am back to loving nixos!

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