I dunno, I feel like the LibremOne news is being overhyped.

Talk is a fork of Riot
Mail is a fork of K9
Social is a fork of Tusky
Tunnel is PIA white-labelled

I see nothing new or innovative here, what am I missing?

@kev No, I think you essentially have it. The only thing unique about this is that it's all coming together under a company known for privacy (when it's known at all).

@kev nothing. Except for the fact that Purism has, at this point, branded it as made by them.

@brandon @kev doesn't free software have a long and storied history of projects "forking" only to change the branding? what is so objectionable about it this time?

@greg @kev the fact that there's no mention about sharing the modified source code. K9 might be fine, but Tusky not so much

As well, in the case of forking and changing brand, there's usually some sort of notice or history that can lead one to the original project.

@kev You are right, but it's refreshing that these apps are rebranded and included by default, I guess?

@kev I'm not a big fan of this policy either. I wish they would focus on producing libre hardware instead of diluting their product portfolio with services.

@kev I guess the fact that they bundled them into one easy-to-use, pretty cheap service and they will be included on the Librem devices by default, making it easier to less tech-savvy folks to start using Matrix and Mastodon

@TomDienstbier @kev this seems like their exact goal. To provide one seemless experience, the theming has to be consistent as well.
Tusky as an app works grear, but they'd have to fork it to seemlessly integrate it in a whole package. Same for the other apps.
Still, as mentioned, credit where credit is due, the original developers of those apps should be in a way benefiting from their suite of apps.

@kev I had the same thought. Seems like maybe selling hardware isn't keeping them in business?

@kev it's not new or innovative, but it's still a great thing since Purism as a brand inspires confidence and respects privacy as their core business

@kev Not only do I think there's nothing special here, it's disappointing to me and makes me question my decision to pre-order the librem5. I hate to feel this way, but maybe I'll feel different tomorrow?
My initial impression is that it's an ungenuine marketing strategy that worries me to be the start of a walled garden hidden behind the word open source. I don't want any of my apps bundled and coupled to my hardware.
But again, it's still early, we'll have to wait and see where this goes.

@nebunez @kev I see your point. Given the fact they delayed the launch of the Librem5 twice (to date) leaves no good aftertaste.

@kev I can see where bundling them together instead of making people go out and find all of these by themselves has value. Otherwise, sure, you can get all this stuff somewhere else.

@kev @amolith I think the story is the cloud service, not the apps.

@sean @kev I like that they have guides on how to delete facebook, whatsapp, twitter, etc.

@sean maybe that the piece I’m missing here? But if they’re just setting up a matrix, imap, Mastodon and a white-labelled vpn service, I still fail to see the innovation here?

@kev @amolith I don't think the point is "innovation" per se, but more "we're setting up a cloud service you pay for with currency rather than personal data and ad views."

My initial reaction was that I do all of that stuff for myself anyway (though for considerably more money than they are charging per month). Still, I'm not their target market which I think is people who would rather not use Google, but don't have the tech skills to self-host all of those services.

@sean yeah, that’s an interesting perspective. Maybe I’m being a little too harsh.

I agree in principle, but marketing makes all the difference. So if it promotes and makes free software easier to access, while supporting projects like the Librem5, I think it helps the cause overall.

Business gonna business collaboration be damned.

@kev they are just indeed paid rebranded fork of already existing stuff, and they are not even crediting the original apps :)

@blacklight447 no, I’ve not seen any edit for the original apps on their website either. Granted, I didn’t look very hard though, so it might be there somewhere.

My only worry with this whole thing is, will there be one unified login for all these services? If so, it's a bit of a case of putting all your eggs in one basket, one gets compromised, they all get compromised ....

@kev I guess they will pointlessly rebrand some apps for vanity reasons.

@kev I'm more confused if these are just Android apps or if they're porting them to linux... which I thought was the point of the Librem 5. As far as I know, there is no K9 for desktop linux. Is everything going to be on Shashlik or one of these emulators? They also mention an iOS mail app if they meet some subscriber goal.

@hrthu I really hope they don’t just run emulators. I think that will likely piss a lot of people off. Purism have a pretty good rep generally speaking, so I’m sure that won’t happen.

@kev I don't know. The whole thing is quite strange. And, honestly, the mix of funding languages--crowd-funding backers, donations, and subscriptions--leaves a bad taste in my mouth. I'm especially irked by the donations bit. One should certainly support independent devs w/ donations--but for companies to appropriate the language is they're Medecins Sans Frontieres or something is rather odious.

@kev this will help onboard Grandma, that's why it's important:)

@LPS will it? The average user doesn’t really give a damn about privacy. The millions (billions?) of people that still use Facebook is testament to that.

@kev okay, a bit of an exaggeration, but it lowers the barrier that's for sure. It certainly makes it an easier sell for any of us to introduce the idea to people we care about.

@kev I think that it's just that they are bundling it all together as a cohesive set of tools for normal people that want privacy. If you walk up to a person on the street and say, "We've got Tusky and K9 and Riot and we protect you with PIA!" they will just run away. If you package it neatly, and show that it has all of things that you might want to do, (I hope) that they'll have a good chance.

@murph “We’ve got tusks, k9, riot and PIA!” 😂😂😂😂 good point!

@kev probably the "it's all packaged in one spot" sort of deal.

plus it's (I feel bad saying this, but..) Librem the same way "it's Apple."

except there is a larger chance it's all fine with Librem poking into it.

but as another previous boost I saw points out, centralization of all the software, even if it's librem, isn't a good thing

@kev also I just saw this was 7 hours ago. sorry if someone already answered

@kev I'd say while efforts like Freedombox holds more attention better, it's great to have someone like them who cares about privacy offering to run these services.

As for the clients I don't want them to make too big changes as they have better things to focus on, and while I think they're trying cater used to silos with their branded apps I wish people would learn to seperate the concepts of client and server.

But it's hard to communicate about things not visible onscreen.

@alcinnz @kev My problem with this is that they seem to be building non-federating silos of federated social applications.

Looks like their Mastodon instance doesn't federate and also hides local and federated timelines.

I'd still recommend getting a libre #selfhosting solution instead which doesn't have a corporation behind it, benefit or not. The data stays on your own computer, you get to decide configuration options, it's more affordable, provides more apps etc.

@njoseph @kev @alcinnz I vaguely remember reading that they were going to do this. The rebranding of apps is ok so long as it's within the license terms, but moving from a Twitter or Facebook silo to a Purism one isn't really all that much progress. It's a bit like the situation with Signal where you can choose any server so long as it's Moxie's.

@njoseph @alcinnz @kev I think that the initiative is good for people who would never selfhost themselves and is offering a full ready to consume product (in contrast to a platform and a myriad of apps for consuming it)...

@njoseph @alcinnz @kev ... Which is good for non tech-savvy people IMHO. And being backed up by a for-profit but socially responsible company seems to be a good foundation for the economic sustainability of the service, which is sometimes the reason of selfhosted instances shutting down.

I think its bad to spread FUD without actually verifying. Especially when someone is just starting up. I already saw someone from service following me here.
@alcinnz @kev

@praveen @njoseph @alcinnz I agree with Praveen here. I’ve seen a few people mention this article from @brandon but the lack of federation is just an assumption at this point, and an incorrect one IMO.

They state that there are millions of people on the network. That impossible without federation. Plus, as Praveen said, people can follow other instances, so that’s clearly not the case.

I really think Brandon should issue a correction.

The blog itself has corrected the assertion here. I think even the root logic of not respecting upstream is flawed here as Purism partnered with Matrix and Mastodon before launching this service.
@njoseph @alcinnz @brandon

@praveen @njoseph @alcinnz @brandon ah, that’s good. I didn’t realise Brandon has done that.

The issue for most about upstream (I think) is the lack of attribution for the hours of work the app devs have put in.

Also the accusation here is not at all considering the track record of Purism. They have a history of working closely and contributing to the projects they ship in their products. The people working there are all key contributors to many well known Free Software projects. As for the credits, it is likely just an oversight. I don't think they want to take credit for other people's work.
@njoseph @alcinnz @brandon

@alcinnz @kev
I think they could've put a "Built with Free Software" paragraph on their landing page, listing the most notable FOSS project they're using and thanking the developers. Just a simple nod to the giants whose shoulders they're standing on.

@Wolf480pl @kev @alcinnz

i'm actually very surprised that they didn't do that considering the lengths they've gone to be FSF compliant on the hardware side.

@kev IMO hype is the thing we need so people start moving to the freedom side of things. The more people will be touched by the hype, the more respect will be paid to free services. And the more support they will get

It is the service bundle from a company, the subscription model instead of extracting and selling data, that is innovative, not the apps. I think it sends a positive and powerful message to people outside the Free Software circle (inside the circle many of us do it already).

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