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I think self-hosting is the future of internet.
I dream of a future where everyone hold and backup their own internet data.
Does it sound realistic? what you guys think?

@ja_nishat yes, but not using traditional hosting or federation. that model has a lot of dangerous flaws that make it easy to embrace, extend, extinguish the network. #p2p is the future imo

@xj9

@ja_nishat

That's my complaint with SOLID. They want to give users more control over their data, but they're still coupling it to servers that are likely to be hosted by behemoths.

@ja_nishat Would be good.... yet I dream of a future where even non-technical people, such as my 60+ parents and my 70+ aunts and uncles, are easily able to use reliable, available services at an "uptime" and "usability" quality of Facebook, WhatsApp, ... without having to bother how to get started, how to use it, or whether it's available when they really need it. If that's self-hosted or not - just a technical thing in my opionion. 😉

@ja_nishat obviously there’s a lot of work to be done to get there, so for now federation is where it’s at.

@ja_nishat That's the goal! We need to keep making it easier to do, though. It needs to be extremely simple if we want to reach that point.

I self host things.

I've been encouraging too.

But the future is not determine by the tech, people or idea.

As an entrepreneur who is constantly looking for ideas which will boom in near future,

I can assure that future is determine by trend.

Once Email dominated the world, now it is used less.

But let us all cherish self hosting now and then.


@ja_nishat

@ja_nishat
As long as ISPs maintain (economic) control of internet traffic, I doubt it will happen.

It's most probably coincidental, but the fact that your ISP keeps you under a NAT is a huge leverage for big companies over the common people.

@rick_777 NAT is problematic to protocol development. the damage is done there. everything is some flavor of HTTP now.

the biggest issue is asymmetric bandwidth in access networks. but that is slowly changing with passive optical networks and some kinds of wireless technologies.

unfortunately 100/10 and 500/20 type packages are still the norm in DOCSIS and xDSL networks. and that limits P2P/self-hosting abilities.

@ja_nishat

@ja_nishat I like the idea of self-hosting a lot but one major problem is that said person needs to have knowledge about the tech they are using which already is quite a huge problem.

I do think decentralization will be part of the future but I don't think every individual holding their own data will be the future.

@ja_nishat It's an interesting idea, and I think it's entirely possible, but someone will have to release a product that makes self hosting easy. I picture a small device, maybe in the form factor of one of the Google Home Hubs (just in form) that will automatically interface with a registrar to setup the necessary internet stuff. Then there would need to be an easy migration integrated for hardware upgrades (similar to smart phones). Then all services would run on the single device.

@ja_nishat imo: Strongly depends on whether there's enough ppl who want to do whatever sysadmin looks like in that future, for there to be roughly one sysadmin per Dunbar unit of people

@ja_nishat @codesections I'm always a little leery of "the future of" posts. Crystal balls always have cracks in 'em. 😃

There will always be a subset of people who will want to offload hosting responsibilities. Under the right conditions, trading money for time is valid.

I do think we need to preserve the option of being able to self-host though. In order to do that, we need to make sure #IPv6 gets deployed everywhere.

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@ja_nishat @codesections As it stands, the big players are gobbling up all of the available IPv4 space. Without IPv6 everywhere, there will come a time where you will be forced to use one of the large providers in order to get a "public" IP address.

If we don't preserve the end-to-end principle, there will always be content providers and consumers. This was not how it was meant to be.

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@ja_nishat

Depending on the use case self hosting can be done. Years ago I played with #freenet and it was functional though I don't know it's current state.

I very much like the idea of a distributed data store.

freenetproject.org/

@ja_nishat Sounds realistic to me. And getting the ISPs on our side would be a huge win for this, because then they can build in something like FreedomBox into each of their routers (which are sure to be full computers anyways).

But if not it wouldn't cost much at all to give people these home servers.

@alcinnz @ja_nishat Unless and until ISPs become something more than rent-seeking monopolies/oligopolies/cartels, there is no hope of getting them on board with such a scheme. Their goal is to monetize you as much as they can.

@ja_nishat @alcinnz ISPs also see support as a pure cost center, so adding even more stuff they need to support is the last thing on their mind unless it makes them a bunch of money.

People do go looking for media servers and network-attached storage and backup, though. No reason someone couldn't buy some existing hardware design in bulk and start putting these things on Amazon, maybe kicked off by a Kickstarter?

@alcinnz @ja_nishat Unfortunately I don't think RPis are really suitable for consumer devices, though, due to their limitation to booting off SD, limited I/O bandwidth, and their tendency to nuke their SD cards. Soldered-in flash and an on-board SATA controller would be better.

@ja_nishat
I think it is. But we need 3 things to make it work:

1. Ethical software that makes it easy to self host.

2. Symmetrical bandwidth from Internet Providers (so uploading stuff isn't super slow).

3. A way to make peer to peer communications easier to use and more reliable so that the cost of transmitting data is shared across all nodes.

Without all 3 available to everyone, a web with everything self hosted may not be possible.

@ja_nishat I think the massive increase in distributed systems research and resulting open source implementations of many foundational needs (gossip & replication protocols, namely) as well as ever cheaper infrastructure ($60/year is "cheap" in "developed" countries -- I wish I had better terms more readily available to me) paired with higher bandwidth to access networks...I think it is very realistic in the next 10 years.

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