Do you remember when Facebook bought WhatsApp and they told us that WhatsApp won't be sharing any data with Facebook?

"WhatsApp Will Delete Your Account If You Don't Agree Sharing Data With Facebook"

@hund No.

If I saw "WhatsApp won't be sharing any data with Facebook" I didn't process it as useful information or anything remotely true.

@hund I'm looking for a good messaging app for our times, if there's one. Is there a NA producer's favorite?

@hund I'll check it out. Thanks! Is it related to jabber?

@maxpowers1 It was Jabber, but they sold the brand Jabber to Cisco and created the open standard under a new name called XMPP.

@hund checking out different options for Android. Nice selection! Thanks again!

@maxpowers1 Conversation for Android is really good. :)

@hund @maxpowers1 XMPP with Conversation is my personal choice as well.

You could also check out Matrix with Element as client.
It has the same feature set as XMPP but some people say it's more user-friendly and perhaps flashier. :)
That's why I use it to communicate with some of my friends. They complained about XMPP not working properly. After I switched them over to Matrix/Element they stopped complaining.

TL;DR: both of them are great alternatives to whatsapp.

@Ghosty @hund I'll try both and see which one works better. I just need to move my family and friends off facebag messenger 😁

@maxpowers1 @hund Getting other people to switch is the hardest thing. My stategy was just quitting WhatsApp and tellung my peers that I use another messenger from now on. That way they have a chance to chat with me using a modern, but different IM or just fallback to e-mail/sms. :D

@Ghosty @hund I know, it'll take time. Some of my family members use WhatsApp, others are using Viber. WhatsApp is terrible by the way..

@maxpowers1 @hund Yep! But in Germany it has become a standart. I no longer use it of course. Quit 2 years ago :opensource:

@Ghosty @hund I tried to use it to chat with my relatives and friends overseas. Let's say, my experience with it was unsatisfactory 🤯

@maxpowers1 @hund From the UX I found it usable :)
I quit because I am not willing to pay the high price, which is my personal information.
Plus I am not trusting a piece of software that says "This chat is end-to-end encrypted" but at the mean time being completely closed source, doesn't give me access to my key pair and doesn't say what it is using to encrypt the messages. It also doesn't allow its users a way to verify if the end-to-end encryption is valid.

@maxpowers1 @hund
WhatsApp likely uses its own servers to perform some kind of validity checking to see if the end-to-end encryption hasn't been tampered with.
But why should you trust anyone except yourself with your personal data?
End-to-end encryption has to work with the least amount of trust possible! This can only be achieved if the only one you trust are those you chat with.

@Ghosty @hund "I have nothing to hide" is the dumbest argument when it comes to privacy. People have no idea who may have access to their info..

@maxpowers1 @hund It is! But it is ridiculous that the users trust a company that doesn't trust it's users by being not even a bit transparent.

@maxpowers1 @hund Another funny thing is that most just say "I have nothing to hide" when it comes to privacy.
I actually found a decent usage for this senseless argument.
Programs who are closed source have something nasty to hide, because otherwise they would be open source since then they "have nothing to hide".

@hund i never forgave whatsapp for their betrayal of the public trust pre-facebook. first, the devs cut the community from modding whatsapp when much if the improvements were driven by cide contributions from public. second, it was always strange that whatsapp refused to work with tablets and computers for no apparent reason than absence of a phone service on the device. remember when whatsapp refused to install on an android tablet sharing the same release as a phone?

@hund but whatevz. those days i was advocating #pownce, then #jitsi. jitsi worked on #symbian. i am not so egotistical as to be angry people did not take what i chose. i am angry because people always follow hype and the unethical, then relieve those that benefit from the wrongs of the responsibility to clean up their shit; passing the sin on to those that have the technical knowhow but benefit not. cf invidious.

@hund Ah yes. Good ol' Facebook. I hope they bring this up in the anti-trust hearings.
Also, I suspect FB are going full asshole before regulations kick in.

@hund Honestly I expected they were doing that already.


"In stark contrast, Signal collects no metadata, whereas Apple's iMessage makes use of only email address (or phone number), search history, and a device ID to attribute a user uniquely."


@Dashtop @hund

To get this kind of detail, this is my "Bible in short". For me, this is a quite useful way to compare that matters.

@PNeurona @Dashtop It's a bible of centralized services. It's not what the world needs. :)

@hund @Dashtop

In fact, what I would prefer to use is XMPP, but I feel being against the tends of all people near me. I really used my account with only one of them and only for time to time. It is really a pity.

(excuse my english, I don't manage too much well writing in this language).

@PNeurona @Dashtop We all have to start somewhere. I had just one contact on XMPP one time in life. :)

@hund @PNeurona but I must agree with moxie on this, messaging needs IMO are more covered by signal

@hund @PNeurona contact discovery, sealed senders, good feature set, active development with good and well known developers. Support from many organizations, ease of use etc.

@Dashtop @PNeurona Contact discovery works because you use a phone number, that's everything but anonymous.

XMPP doesn't need "sealed senders", because it's not a centralized services to begin with.

Good feature sets?

XMPP and all the software around it is well maintained as well. It's also supported AND used by many well known companies.

It's also a lot easier to use. It's also not exclusive in any way. You can use it however you want to use it.

@hund What? Facebook is not a non-profit?

Oh my god, how unpredictable this was. :p

@polarfuchs It was, wasn't it! Literally one saw this coming, especially not Mark himself! :O

@hund /Delete your account/? Okay what the fuck, wow.

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