@emsenn @kwnd @sir

That's interesting. Y'all definitely know more about Emacs than I do, but my outsider perspective was that there was less of a right way to do it because things were so customizable/personal.

I'd thought that one of the reasons that Emacs/lisp didn't gain more popularity was precisely that there *isn't* a right way to do it, and thus isn't a community-accepted solution to common problems (Cf. winestockwebdesign.com/Essays/)

@kwnd @sir @emsenn

> Software is no good if you can’t change it and bend it to your will.

100% agreed.

> That’s easier to do with small, simple programs

I'm not *sure* I agree with this. Maybe it's too much time dealing with bad NPM packages, but I kind of wonder whether a program with a cohesive abstraction could offer *more* ability to change it—that's certainly the lisp/emacs/stumpwm pitch, and I wonder how much truth there is to it

(Emphasis on *wonder*—I haven't made my mind up)


> You may wish to monitor you use of "you" when you mean "I" in future posts.

That seems like good general advice for anyone. But, in this particular case, in the toot you replied to @emsenn asked @kelbot

> Can you come up with /a/ (or a few) criteria you use to judge which way you lean in a situation?

The "which way *you* lean" seemed (to me) to explicitly endorse the idea that different people might have different leanings/routes that are right for them


> is that the entirety of your vimrc? its awesome if it is;

Sadly, I'm not nearly that awesome. That's the first 5 lines of my .vimrc—the other ~400 didn't make the picture. (In partial defense, it's only 315 SLoC)


Possibly related: en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Hedg

Maybe there are some areas where the benefit of breaking things down into smaller abstractions outweigh the gains from fitting things together into a cohesive abstraction?

(At least according to en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Philip_E)


Oh, I didn't consider the terminal emulator to be part of the same stack—I'm using st with either setup :D

@Jason_Dodd @emsenn

Yeah, fair enough. I guess I *want* there to be some sort of grand answer, applicable in general. But that's not how the world actually works—in reality, it depends on the actual tools, and probably on the personality of the user involved/their comfort with the abstractions in question.

@pkotrcka @distrotube

Yeah, fair point that many were designed to be used together. (Though actually only two—dwm and dmenu—are suckless projects)

@bugaevc @sir @emsenn

Probably, yeah ¯\_(ツ)_/¯

But then my decision about what WM to use would be very easy, and what fun would that be :D


> I rarely find that I like everything about a particular system, so having something modular is important

Hmm, but there are multiple ways to come at modularity, right? Like, that sounds like an argument for the dwm stack, but it's a little bit odd to say that it's *more* customizable than the stumpwm stack when stumpwm is literally written in lisp and can be customized by adding in modules (either my own or those written by others)

@pkotrcka @distrotube

(See follow-up toot—I'm more getting at the question of what it means for something to be "simpler" than I am at the specific technical merits of the respective stacks)

^^^ is getting at a bigger-picture question: Is it simpler to have multiple small tools that work together (the ), at the cost of grafting together tools written in different languages, operating with different abstractions, that weren't designed to work together?

Or is it simpler to have a single, coherent abstraction, at the cost of code bloat and sacrificing some on the one-job-per tool front?

(Related to debates I've had with @emsenn in one direction and @sir in the other)

I'm trying to decide between two window manager setups:

, manage windows dwm.suckless.org/
, launch programs tools.suckless.org/dmenu/
, access passwords
, set alarm github.com/codesections/dlarm
, manage panes github.com/tmux/tmux/wiki
-or-raise, run program or focus it if already running github.com/Soft/run-or-raise

, all of the above + more with extensive lisp config, stumpwm.github.io/

Which of these is simpler? Better?

Have any of y'all ever used ? I didn't think there was a window manager out there that could lure me away from my beloved , but stump just *might* be the one to do it

(still in the testing phase, though)


So apparently, @Purism is developing a Mastodon client for the ?? That's cool.

@besserwisser yeah, I thought about that too. But it's not like dwm would work on Wayland any better, so :shrug:

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