covid, ethics 

A quick look at data on Switzerland indicates that the vast majority of covid deaths (~90%) are accounted for by people over the age of 80 who are not vaccinated

ourworldindata.org/grapher/cov

ourworldindata.org/grapher/swi

Does this not imply that the great majority of deaths comes from voluntary non-vaccination in the group of people are aware of what death means?

I fail to make a convincing argument for current corona measures given this information.

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covid, ethics 

@douginamug Problem is that these people will still take up hospital beds, so if there's a big wave it becomes impossible to care for vaccinated non-Covid patients. So either hospitals should be able to refuse non-vaccinated Covid patients or we have to keep society-wide measures to prevent big waves.

covid, ethics 

@douginamug I spent a week on intensive care myself in summer 2020 for a non-Covid issue. Luckily this was during a low-point between two Covid waves, but if all the beds had been occupied then I wouldn't have gotten the care I needed.

covid, ethics 

@brecht I'm very glad to hear you got the care you needed!

And that's absolutely the point I wanted to make: the issue appears to be an overloaded medical system.

Restricting the livelihoods of the populace, the overwhelming majority of whom won't be seriously affected, for the sake of a few, elderly people who don't want to be vaccinated, feels like collective punishment.

covid, ethics 

@brecht here in europe, it looks like vaccination will become compulsory in more and more countries.

I feel like the most rational thing, if going that route, would be to bring it in in reverse age order. Perhaps once the 80+ are done, we're back within healthcare system bounds!

(Sorry if this sounds cold/ageist. Not intention.)

covid, ethics 

@douginamug Personally, if we're going to impose vaccine mandates (as I think we should), I much prefer imposing it for everyone above 18. Drawing any other distinction between adult citizens feels tricky to me, both legally and ethically.

I'm not comfortable with the already widespread mandates for health care workers for the same reason. Seems very harsh to single out people who've had suffered so much the last two years.

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