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Am I the only person who thinks that electric cars might not be the best use of centrally generated electricity, if the batteries lose 40-60% of their power just by being outdoors in the cold weather?
Maybe we should work harder on other alternatives to oil and gas?

@bjb

What alternatives do you propose? Renewable electricity is getting cheaper every year, I just don't see how any other alternative infrastructure could compete with the price and plentiful availability of renewable electricity.

Also, the battery loss in cold is heavily dependent on the battery chemistry. Lithium iron phosphate batteries are finally being put into electric cars like Tesla's. It's much more stable in cold / hot conditions compared to lithium ion batteries.

@Graycot For alternatives ... I think we'd have a hard time just replacing current energy use with renewable - not even considering the enormous increase if everyone used electric transport.
Re Tesla battery chemistry - I was talking to current Tesla owners to get those numbers of energy loss from batteries in cold weather. That energy is actually lost even if you move the car to a warm spot (like heated garage) after it loses the energy in the cold.

@bjb
Renewable energy is not increasing fast enough, but what alternative is there? Seems like none to me.

The energy loss of Teslas in the cold is negligible on the world scale. Electric is still far more efficient than fossil fuels (Granted, the battery materials do take quite a bit of energy to acquire)

Current Tesla battery chemistry has a few concerning problems, but luckily they have announced a switch from Li-ion to LiFePo4. It's A step in the right direction.
(tinyurl.com/mub4dpcj)

@bjb rather than the efficiency of the batteries, I’m more concerned about the sustainability and resources used in mining all that lithium. Are we just moving the problem?

I do think overall electric cars are a huge improvement over petrol/diesel.

@kev I agree the huge amount of these metals is another large problem for using batteries at scale in transport. But, all the people saying batteries in transport is so much better than gas - but some electric plants still use oil/gas to operate - and now we are throwing away 40-60% of that generated energy in cold weather. Not to mention the inefficiency of storing energy in batteries even at room temperature. Not saying we don't need to get off oil and gas ... but ...

@bjb I believe the root of the problem is our growing dependency on energy. Better batteries will be (and are being) developed. Electric vehicles are far more energy efficient than regular cars ( fueleconomy.gov/feg/atv-ev.sht ). Unfortunately humanity's consumption of energy is also growing. Every time we find a way to save energy, we quickly find a place to spend it. The best solutions for now are mass transport and walking or biking.

@bjb No, you are not alone. The only logical way to solve this is NUKE but nuke is not woke and if everyone had their own little 'pocket reactor' the treacherous cretins running things would have nothing left to use as a cudgel against the masses.

@bjb I think the battery powered cars is a terrible idea. Rare Earth metals are >> rare << this seems to be something that people are not factoring in

The environmental damage from their extraction is devastating ecosystems that we may not be able to regenerate going forwards 😪💔

It's already a lot drier for more months & wetter in a shorter but more torrential way in many places than it used to be... some plants can't handle that especially when they are trying to get established 😬

If the plants are gone then the invertebrates & animals that rely on them have ongoing problems too...

@bjb getting trees established in a hostile environment is really, really hard... I lose between 30 to 70% of the trees I plant now depending on how bad the year is... & I'm also having to choose completely different species

Even ten years ago you might only lose 3 to a maximum of 5 per 100 🤦‍♀️

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