I think I am experiencing an emotion called Betrayal? Probably because I have abandon a Distro that I used and had experience my ups and downs with for 3 years (Debian :debian: ). At this point I don't what to do. I just got Manjaro :manjaro: but some thing just doesn't feel right ya know. It could also be that because of that bad first experience with a bug that I have encountered in Manjaro with the themes kind of set me to a bad mood or it could also be me. I just don't know what to do😖...

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@0PT41N Sometimes a distro just doesn't sit right with you. One good thing about Linux is if you try a distro and don't like it you can just try a different one since there are hundreds of options.

If Manjaro doesn't work for you that's perfectly fine. There are plenty of fish in the sea.

@0PT41N @Mundon

I feel that if you want to stick to debian, try out MX Linux. It installs easily, let's you choose encryption.

Defaults without systemd, but you can enable it at boot.

Ships with flatpak, as well as testing and backports in their custom package manager.

Has the best themed XFCE out the box.

I don't know. It is home to me.

I get the same feelings with Manjaro. Used to use it exclusively, now I can't stand it.

Bonus, graphical LUKS password.

@rebel_luddite @Mundon I tried out MX before the thing that I didn't like much was that the Installer was a bit confusing and forces you to make a root account *not very secure* and there is only 2 DE xfce and kde my fav is gnome

@0PT41N @Mundon

Ah, yeah, the installer is a bit minimal and opinionated.

I didn't realize that having a root account like that was not secure, I have to read up on that.

I like the quirk of using the root password when things get serious... and sudo-ing everything else.

I guess it is a bit redundant, but there is probably a way to make that more secure and useful.

Any other DE... yeah, it requires customizing.

@rebel_luddite @Mundon I used to think the same way about using root account and not having to sudo everything. Its just that if some one were to access your computer they have full access to everything. meh you will get used to using sudo in everything once you get a normal admin account if your willing to😁

@0PT41N @Mundon

Oh, yeah, any other distro, you use sudo for everything.

I just thought it was funny that it would make you put in the root password for their graphical updates and mx package installer, usb tools, etc.. but is absolutely bypassed when using the commandline.

I guess that is the actual reason. There are enough tools to administer the system for the new user, they never need touch the terminal.

I should make my life easier and stick to one pass.... no, that would be worse.

@rebel_luddite @Mundon The more I think about going back to Debian the more annoyingly frustrating it gets😖 . Because With Manjaro :manjaro: you get bleeding edge performance which in Debian :debian: you don't even if you use the Testing edition

@0PT41N @rebel_luddite @Mundon

I bounced around a bit then just went back to Manjaro. The grass wasn't any greener. Found a updated library in the AUR/Github which lowered my CPU consumption by 20-30% when decoding 500+Mb/second of video over a network link. Some distros just choked out of the box. I'm running at 27% cpu with Arch.

@0PT41N @Mundon

I feel that. I think about going back to Manjaro for that very reason.

Want to know the petty reason I don't put up with it?

I hate the ugly text prompt for putting in the encryption password, and that it throws you into grub if you mess up.

That is the most hateful default.

I tried getting into Fedora, but the programs I like to use are inconsistently updated, and I don't want to go out of my way to add use repos just for one package.

Maybe look into ArtiX?

@rebel_luddite @Mundon Oh yea that shit happen to me today oh man did I hated that so much😠. even for a distro that is so popular on Distrowatch.com why couldn't they have made a GUI for the encryption prompt or a nicer better way of letting you unlock using the cli that doesn't throw you back to the grub menu when you mess up once. also another person on mastodon @werwolf told me that Arco :arcolinux: was another good one to tryout

@rebel_luddite @Mundon @werwolf yep I know that feeling especial if your working with Servers like me😕 *sys admin noob*

@0PT41N @rebel_luddite if you want to stick with Arch based distros but want to skip Manjaro I highly recommend Garuda. That's my current distro of choice.

@Mundon @0PT41N

I think I saw a review on in. It is very pretty.

I will have to look into it deeper.

@Mundon @rebel_luddite Looks like Gruda main DE of choice is Garuda KDE Dr460nized. Looks pretty bad ass😎

@0PT41N @Mundon

Yeah, it is the first theming of KDE that made me think, maybe this DE is worth getting into.

I just need to get over the Mortal Kombat naming scheme for KDE programs.

Kan't even bring up a terminal.

@rebel_luddite @Mundon And that's one of the things why I like KDE for. Because It encourages the user to customize there OS what ever way you want it to be

@0PT41N @Mundon

Oh, definitely. It is so modular, I don't know why I avoid it.

I guess I got on the "lowest ram possible" bandwagon and stayed on. XFCE fills that, it is simple, but damn it is simple.

Tiling WM is the ultimate in lean computing, but no way I am going to enjoy it as the ultimate look and feel, not even for aesthetics.

KDE is the lead on creating any UI you want, and make it truly futuristic.

I am not into retro revival. I like and use old things, but nostalgia is defeat.

@rebel_luddite @Mundon I noticed that Guruda also has a preference in using the shell called fish? which is the 2nd most popular according to slant.co
---URL Link---
slant.co/topics/16984/~linux-s

@0PT41N @Mundon

I use fish whenever I remember to install it. Hah.

I am starting to get into scripting, and the recommendation to stick to bash, or dash if you want to be fully POSIX, is upsetting.

The recommendation is made so that your scripts are compatible with the universe.

Why care? It is your damn computer, who are you trying to please?

I may skip learning Bash scripting and just study fish.

For heavier things... I will learn guile.

Script-lang is a highly personal choice

@0PT41N @rebel_luddite That's the one I'm rocking on two machines right now.

@Mundon @rebel_luddite I am gonna check out Garuda Gnome edition in a Virtual environment

@Mundon @0PT41N @rebel_luddite if you want to stay with an arch based distro, why not try arch?;)

@sotolf @Mundon @0PT41N

And what then, start collecting scripts to run so I don't need to spend dumbass time getting it how I like it for every new install?

Automate the process so I only need to run a single post-installation script?

Learn how Arch packages programs so I can avoid the AUR, the biggest tease in the Linux world?

Fine. I'll look into that, but I will stop way before rolling my own ISOs.

@rebel_luddite @Mundon @0PT41N I do one install every 4-5 years or so, why would you reinstall your systems that often? My recommendation for arch only goes for personal systems, Personally I'd never use it for servers etc. AUR is great, never had anything not work from there that I couldn't fix.

But yeah if you don't want to learn, and want a distro that hides all the ugliness from you it's not for you.

@sotolf @Mundon @rebel_luddite In order for me to install Vanilla Arch Linux :archlinux: . I would have to manually set the partitions and do other complex things that I had never had to do on Debian :debian: based Distros before. Ill try it one last time to see if I can follow some guides and use the arch wiki for help

My motivational Links
---URL_Link---
youtube.com/watch?v=VbeSMuY-Mb

---Guide Links I want to use---
youtube.com/watch?v=PQgyW10xD8

itsfoss.com/install-arch-linux

wiki.archlinux.org/index.php/I

@0PT41N @Mundon @rebel_luddite I'd suggest against following a guide if possible, the wiki should be enough, if you feel like you have to follow a guide, make sure that it's a very recent one, and that it's using similar hardware to you, if you don't feel ready to do the install using only the wiki, then maybe using some derivate like arco or manjaro will be a better choice, I'd suggest doing a couple of test runs in a vm, and only try when you're feeling safe that you can do it.

@sotolf @Mundon @rebel_luddite OK ill keep that in mind. the only part that gets me stumped is the partition part

@0PT41N @Mundon @rebel_luddite You have to do partitioning for most installs though no? if you're not comfortable using cfdisk you could always partition the disk using gparted in your current system before you start the install, then you just skip that step in the installing and just mount the partitons you already created. I rutinly have to repartition stuff with cfdisk at work so I'm kind of used to the cli tools.

@sotolf @Mundon @rebel_luddite They are not using the cfdisk the Arch wiki says to use the fdisk *don't know if there both the same* and most of the partitioning in Debian is done automatically so I don't really have to do much

@0PT41N @Mundon @rebel_luddite I skipped the partition part of the wiki because I already knew how to do ip. cfdisk is on the live image, so you can use that if you know it, I find it quite a bit easier to use than fdisk. But getting used to using tools like that is the reason why I would advise to do it in a vm once or twice before you do it live, just to make sure you don't break your system.

@sotolf @Mundon @rebel_luddite Yeah I am practicing my arch install skills in the vm as we speak

@0PT41N @Mundon @rebel_luddite That's a good thing to do no matter what :) if nothing else it's something you can use to rescue any of your system in case something happens, I have rescued linux servers at work that was totally borked through chrooting into it.

@0PT41N @sotolf @Mundon

VMs are the greatest gift in computing.

VMs are perfect for practicing with new distros, since the installation is often the most difficult part, right next to learning a new init system and mastering a new package system, especially when they are source based.

Sometimes they are the perfect endgame environment, either for older and non-linux systems, or as a space for focused work, like writing.

@rebel_luddite @0PT41N @Mundon They are also a godsend in a small buisness to be able to backup, snapshot and deal with servers and needs, just the ability to add more storage space to a critical running server without having to reboot it is fantastic.

@sotolf @0PT41N @Mundon

I seriously need to take a course on Linux administration, either with a book, or one of the sites recommended on Reddit.

I can use Linux like I can speak Spanish, with is deceivingly less fluent than people think, and I am not able to express myself freely with any complex topic.

I recently discovered a Youtube channel called ServeTheHome, also a website, and I think I will begin there.

I have plenty old machines to play with. I just need to set them up learn.

@rebel_luddite @0PT41N @Mundon installing, using, breaking and fixing arch linux was what did it for me, nothing is more motivating to learn fixing something than completely borking something that you kind of want to use :p

@sotolf @0PT41N @Mundon

After awhile, and admittedly it takes a long time, the honeymooon period of using Linux, the sheer novelty, ridding yourself of limiting and spying operating systems, any installation become a damn chore.

Getting out of beginner hell (where I apparently am) is necessary.

Scripting, automation, backing up. These are the most important things to learn at the outset.

Afterwards, you can really start to play.

Create programs through sheer piping. Compile stuff.

@rebel_luddite @0PT41N @Mundon

I've been using linux for over 15 years by now, I only install it once about every 4-5 years, when I get a new cheapo machine, it's not something you have to do often.

It's no problem, just go out of your comfort zone, run with a windowmanager instead of a big DE, debloat, write scripts that are convenient for you, learn how to understand configuration files, read logs etc, by far learning how to read logs is one of the most useful skills that you can have.

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