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I'll be honest, I don't (yet) understand why so many people hate . Perhaps someone could point me to some good arguments for/against?

@5am the main thing is the unix philosophy.
Systemd is a whole suite of programs that tend to need each other to work fine.
But you cant really only use one of them alone, so you end up having to install it all (although it tends to come preinstalled anyways)

Other init systems are more independent and tend to work well with all programs, since each only focus on their own task and stuff.

I don't really mind but that's one reason I would

@5am I don't know all the reasons. The first I always hear is that it is contrary to the philosophy of Unix.

* It is one thing trying to do many things (not always good, but good enough) rather than one thing to do one thing well.

I have seen comments regarding boot times, security (because it is involved in so many processes), and also complaints that it was developed by Red Hat (IBM).

It is easy to try different distros that do not come with systemd. Devuan and MX come to mind.

@bbbhltz I guess I've never known/used GNU/Linux without it, and I'm not experienced enough to know the ins and outs of its significance, flaws etc, though I do have a grasp of simple service management, creating files for custom services etc. That's one aspect I've always thought was great.

@5am for people who've suffered through maintaining start/stop scripts for multiple init systems over the years, the uniformity of systemd is a godsend.

Most of the animosity stems from people who are unwilling to learn something new and adjust to the admittedly different ways. For example, you can't just `tail -f syslog`. But in the old days you also couldn't `journalctl -u postfix --since -1h`. So yeah.
@bbbhltz

@fedops @5am I am fine either way, to be honest. When I used MX I didn't even know it used a different init system. I don't have servers or develop anything. Once in a blue moon I have to restart a service and the manpage gets me the answer I need.

@bbbhltz @fedops same situation with me, including trying MX once and not realising the difference.

@5am

it appears that the nosystemd.org site is offline; but my arguments:

1. I dislike overengineered things. I prefer simplicity.
2. The argument that is always shoved in my face about systemd is that the ONLY alternative to systemd is 'initscripts.' It's not. (I personally use runit.)
3. "working as designed" does not mean the design shouldn't be reviewed or amended.

@5am i dont like systemd for the same reason i dont like DEs, i want a minimal system and not a bunch of stuff i will never use. i just want an init system and not everything else that comes with systemd.

@5am
For: Far better startup system tham sysv style init scripts with proper dependencies, readable definitions, etc.

Against: In addition to that, also changes a huge number of other things, especially in the system interface.

Also against: Reinventing lots of daemons to live in pid 1, usually with deficiencies that are brushed off by project: dns resolver, ntp, etc.

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